Darwin vs. Deity: Understanding Evolution and its relationship to Creation (12/07)
Below is the script from the online chat "Darwin vs. Deity: Understanding Evolution and it's relationship to Creation" held 12/11/07 at 8pm CST and sponsored by LivingBold. Dr. Paul Boehlke, professor of biology at Wisconsin Lutheran College, hosted. His biographical information is contained in the chat script below.
chatmaster (Dec 11, 2007 9:00:19 PM)
Our chat host this evening is Dr. Paul Boehlke, professor of Biology at Wisconsin Lutheran College in Milwaukee, WI. Dr. Boehlke’s education includes a B.S. from Dr. Martin Luther College in New Ulm, MN; M.S. from Winona State University; M.S.T. from Union College, NY; and Ph.D. from the University of Iowa. He has taken several post-doctoral courses, published several articles on a variety of scientific topics and issues, and has also participated in or managed several research projects, many of which involve WLC students. He gives presentations often on Creation and Evolution and is ready to answer your questions on that subject this evening!
omega (Dec 11, 2007 9:00:21 PM)
Good evening
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:00:56 PM)
greetings to everyone
JenE (Dec 11, 2007 9:01:01 PM)
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maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:01:08 PM)
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maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:01:24 PM)
hey everyone
chatmaster (Dec 11, 2007 9:01:33 PM)
Welcome
T-Bone (Dec 11, 2007 9:01:37 PM)
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coffey (Dec 11, 2007 9:01:47 PM)
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maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:02:10 PM)
has anyone heard anything about the new ben stein movie "expelled" about evolution vs. intelligent design?
T-Bone (Dec 11, 2007 9:02:22 PM)
not here
JenE (Dec 11, 2007 9:02:47 PM)
we talked about it in bio last week, but not for long.
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:03:02 PM)
the trailer on the official web site looks pretty cool
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:03:15 PM)
jenE, what was said about it in bio?
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:03:27 PM)
What was the idea behind it? ...that ID can't be taught in public schools
JenE (Dec 11, 2007 9:03:31 PM)
i knew i should have been paying attention :)
House (Dec 11, 2007 9:03:34 PM)
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T-Bone (reconnect) (Dec 11, 2007 9:03:41 PM)
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JenE (Dec 11, 2007 9:03:52 PM)
yeah. and how silly it is that anyone would want to teach ID in public school
Dean (Dec 11, 2007 9:03:57 PM)
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omega (Dec 11, 2007 9:04:03 PM)
is that movie on dvd or playing now?
JenE (Dec 11, 2007 9:04:04 PM)
because that is obviously not how it happened
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:04:08 PM)
paul, that people who support ID are having their freedom of speech supressed
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:04:41 PM)
it looks like a case study demonstrating supression of ID theorists by evolutionists
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:04:51 PM)
www.expelledthemovie.com
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:05:07 PM)
omega, i think it opens in february
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:05:10 PM)
2008
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:05:10 PM)
Ah, I see. ID does have a religious agenda behind it.
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:05:28 PM)
paul, is ID different from believing in creation?
Agape (Dec 11, 2007 9:05:32 PM)
what's ID?
Liz (Dec 11, 2007 9:05:39 PM)
Wow, I feel old... when I learned about how the world came to be in school, we were given multiple different theories...including Intelligent design...and told to pick the one we wanted to believe...you mean they don't teach ID at all in public schools anymore?
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:05:53 PM)
liz, i don't know
JenE (Dec 11, 2007 9:06:25 PM)
they dont teach it where i go (public college in AZ) its all based on evolution.
coffey (Dec 11, 2007 9:06:27 PM)
sup
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:06:28 PM)
liz, what other theories were you taught besides ID and evolution?
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:06:34 PM)
hey coffey
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:06:40 PM)
Intelligent Design = there are things in Creation that are too complex to have evolved one step at a time
coffey (Dec 11, 2007 9:06:41 PM)
hey
Liz (Dec 11, 2007 9:07:04 PM)
big bang, nebular theory, and a few other weird/obscure ones (that was back in 1994, so I don't remember them all)
House (Dec 11, 2007 9:07:05 PM)
i once heard that the self-esteem movement was a direct result of teaching evolution, that as people kept hearing how they were the products of primordial ooze and random chance, they were not feeling so good about themselves and needed a lift. Any reactions?
Agape (Dec 11, 2007 9:07:11 PM)
so no more ape evolution - i see
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:07:36 PM)
don't know about that House, but wouldn't be suprised
JenE (Dec 11, 2007 9:07:46 PM)
i "learned" last week, that humans were once giant sperm whales...yes an exact quote from my teacher.
coffey (Dec 11, 2007 9:07:58 PM)
ya
omega (Dec 11, 2007 9:08:08 PM)
lol
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:08:16 PM)
Paul, ever heard of JenE's teacher's theory before?
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:08:19 PM)
I haven't
JenE (Dec 11, 2007 9:08:57 PM)
he said it was obvious to see, because some of our cells only vary slightly
coffey (Dec 11, 2007 9:08:59 PM)
me either!
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:09:03 PM)
Something like that sounds strange but science is looking for natural causes. Actually, I think that the whales went back into the water.
Liz (Dec 11, 2007 9:09:06 PM)
I just have the fin now of trying to talk about how the world came to be with students in my grad school classes. 50% of them try to say that you can believe in both creation and evolution because they can go together hand-in-hand, but I cannot see what they are talking about
chatmaster (Dec 11, 2007 9:09:27 PM)
How do your teachers handle discussing Creation and Evolution?
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:09:29 PM)
me either liz
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:09:34 PM)
They are saying that God used evolution to create us.
JenE (Dec 11, 2007 9:09:35 PM)
i have a teacher who says that too, Liz
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:09:58 PM)
This is theistic evolution.
Liz (Dec 11, 2007 9:10:09 PM)
But then that throws out the 6 days of the Bible... Since things could not evolve in 6 days....
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:10:18 PM)
Right
T-Bone (reconnect) (Dec 11, 2007 9:10:46 PM)
some would argue that, Liz
arthur (Dec 11, 2007 9:10:57 PM)
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Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:11:13 PM)
How so?
coffey (Dec 11, 2007 9:11:14 PM)
i am gonna go godbye everyone
Liz (Dec 11, 2007 9:11:21 PM)
True, one classmate tries to argue that it wasn't 6 24 hr days in my class
House (Dec 11, 2007 9:11:22 PM)
Paul, what would be a good, quick read that would show what the major flaws with evolution are...that teens could use as a resource?
omega (Dec 11, 2007 9:11:35 PM)
I once heard there are scientists that are christian and that they have more proof of creation
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:11:48 PM)
paul, isn't it true that evolution is highly improbable from a mathematical chance standpoint? and if so, how can scientists continue to consider evolution viable?
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:12:04 PM)
house, good question about a resource
T-Bone (reconnect) (Dec 11, 2007 9:12:07 PM)
some would say that there is debate in translation.....and what length of time was actually meant/inferred
Rob (Dec 11, 2007 9:12:20 PM)
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Liz (Dec 11, 2007 9:12:30 PM)
I've heard that one too often T-Bone
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:12:35 PM)
The thing is to realize that there are assumptions in science. One big one is that there are only natural cause for things in nature.
Agape (Dec 11, 2007 9:13:01 PM)
So no "super power" you mean
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:13:11 PM)
Right
Agape (Dec 11, 2007 9:13:33 PM)
Yet how do they explain say a hurricane?
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:13:36 PM)
As soon as you say supernatural, it is not science.
T-Bone (reconnect) (Dec 11, 2007 9:14:06 PM)
Paul, I'm guessing many scientists would disagree with that statement you made
T-Bone (reconnect) (Dec 11, 2007 9:14:12 PM)
here's what I mean....
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:14:27 PM)
Hurricane are natural events caused by uneven heating of the earth.
T-Bone (reconnect) (Dec 11, 2007 9:14:41 PM)
Many scientists would sat that science doesn't necessarily try to assume anything....
Liz (Dec 11, 2007 9:15:04 PM)
Yea, several of my professors as a undergrad tried to "prove" to me scientifically why Creation was not possible. It's just something I learned to answer test questions and pass the course, without believing it myself
T-Bone (reconnect) (Dec 11, 2007 9:15:14 PM)
scientists tend to want to substantiate theories/behaviors/phenomenon by evidence
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:15:16 PM)
Many scientists do believe in God.
T-Bone (reconnect) (Dec 11, 2007 9:15:27 PM)
Yes, Paul
Rob (Dec 11, 2007 9:15:29 PM)
I've heard it said that although there are mutations, there are no mutations that result in the addition of information, only reduction. Is this a good argument to use to show that evolution is not a fact?
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:15:38 PM)
paul, do many scientists who believe in God have to conduct research as though they don't?
omega (Dec 11, 2007 9:15:45 PM)
How can you believe in both?
House (Dec 11, 2007 9:15:55 PM)
Anyone want to bite on the good resource telling about evolution's flaws?
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:16:06 PM)
science deals with hypotheses that can be disproven. If it cannot be disproven, it isn't science.
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:16:28 PM)
so because Creation can't be disproven it's not considered science?
Agape (Dec 11, 2007 9:16:41 PM)
Well then, you can't prove there is or isn't a God- you just believe
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:16:51 PM)
Right. You also cannot disprove God.
T-Bone (reconnect) (Dec 11, 2007 9:16:59 PM)
agreed
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:17:32 PM)
I might add, that a natural origin also cannot be disproven.
omega (Dec 11, 2007 9:17:37 PM)
What's interesting is that creation has not changed, yet evolution continually changes the story.
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:17:46 PM)
paul, getting back to House's question...do you have a good resource you'd recommend that gives a quick explanation of the flaws in evolutionary theory?
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:17:48 PM)
Science changes.
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:17:58 PM)
I'm writing a book.
omega (Dec 11, 2007 9:18:03 PM)
correct
House (Dec 11, 2007 9:18:05 PM)
thanks, maestro
House (Dec 11, 2007 9:18:23 PM)
when will the book be out?
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:18:35 PM)
i was just going to ask that house...
Rob (Dec 11, 2007 9:18:44 PM)
Evolution Exposed, by Roger Patterson, seems to have some good info
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:18:53 PM)
I think that it is a mistake to pick around on science and try to find errors. If there are errors, other scientists will fix them.
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:19:13 PM)
I'm working on it. Really....
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:19:17 PM)
so why hasn't anybody fixed (dismissed) evolution once and for all?
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:19:26 PM)
or does that result in black-listing?
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:19:50 PM)
Rob, where can one purchase Evolution Exposed?
chatmaster (Dec 11, 2007 9:19:57 PM)
What kind of persecution do you face as a believer in Creation?
Rob (Dec 11, 2007 9:19:58 PM)
Some many people are told that evolution is a fact. I think it is useful to let them know it is only a theory
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:19:59 PM)
You cannot disprove macroevolution
House (Dec 11, 2007 9:20:03 PM)
what do we do until your book is out? is there a cliff's notes to refute evolution?
Brian (Dec 11, 2007 9:20:22 PM)
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Rob (Dec 11, 2007 9:20:24 PM)
AnswersinGenesis.org sells it
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:20:31 PM)
thanks, rob
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:20:47 PM)
Theories are treated in science as if they are true. They are not proven, but they have not been falsified.
Liz (Dec 11, 2007 9:21:24 PM)
In academia (in science), there is quite a bit of persecution. Religious-based beliefs are seen as superficial and professors and other students will let you know that quickly. At least at my school.
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:21:32 PM)
Theory has a different meaning in science.
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:22:00 PM)
Yes, Liz IT is getting worse.
House (Dec 11, 2007 9:22:06 PM)
i once heard that the chances of evolution being correct are as likely as a functioning 747 resulting from a tornado hitting a junk yard.
T-Bone (reconnect) (Dec 11, 2007 9:22:38 PM)
Rob/Paul, I agree with your assessment that evolution theory is too often presented in public schools as fact, But Paul, I think you are off base by making a blanket statement that "Theories are treated in science as if they are true"........
T-Bone (reconnect) (Dec 11, 2007 9:22:56 PM)
.........it is a case by case basis
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:23:02 PM)
House - But Darwin came up with a mechanism, nautral selection to conserve that which was good.
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:23:44 PM)
Atomic theory - We have not seen atoms.
omega (Dec 11, 2007 9:23:44 PM)
So as a Christian, raising children, how do we (they) respond in the school system. Do we(they) stand up for Jesus or do we give responses to get the grade?
T-Bone (reconnect) (Dec 11, 2007 9:23:46 PM)
......but, I think we all, even Christians believing in Scriptural inspiration, have a starting point of premises
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:24:17 PM)
omega, VERY good question...
T-Bone (reconnect) (Dec 11, 2007 9:24:22 PM)
without a starting foundation, we'd be hard-pressed to draw any conslusions at all in our lives
Liz (Dec 11, 2007 9:24:30 PM)
I would agree that in science theories are true...there asre several theories in Physics that we have never seen, but assume are true
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:24:32 PM)
Christians should not disrupt classroom. But teachers must respect religion.
Rob (Dec 11, 2007 9:24:48 PM)
Darwin made huge assumptions. that Variety and adaptation within a species (goldfinches) can result in changes to another kind. We have no observation of that kind of change which includes addition of genetic information
Liz (Dec 11, 2007 9:24:49 PM)
that should say theories are seen as true
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:24:53 PM)
paul, it's hardly ever a two-way street
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:25:03 PM)
that's the point of that "expelled" movie by ben stein, i think
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:25:52 PM)
T-Bone is right - you have to make assumptions to think. But the assumptions should be on the table. He who identifies the assumptions is usually no friend of the conclusions.
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:26:09 PM)
paul, good point
Rob (Dec 11, 2007 9:26:19 PM)
I think that words have to be used carefully. We can use the word evolution or change or variety or survival of the fittest or adaption. we observe all this.
T-Bone (reconnect) (Dec 11, 2007 9:26:51 PM)
Paul, agreed that the "givens" should be presented and advertised.
Agape (Dec 11, 2007 9:27:23 PM)
Exactly, what is the current thought?
T-Bone (reconnect) (Dec 11, 2007 9:27:28 PM)
In the WELS community, for example, the WELS has a premise that Scripture was "inspired" by God
Rob (Dec 11, 2007 9:27:52 PM)
how many closet creationists are in the scientific field, quietly agreeing with the Bible but keeping quiet about it in their field?
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:27:54 PM)
I was on a radio program with a prof. from UW. He agreed that the assumptions force science to come up with some kind of evolutionary beginning.
T-Bone (reconnect) (Dec 11, 2007 9:28:06 PM)
the WELS uses this premise to formulate other conclusions about their world
T-Bone (reconnect) (Dec 11, 2007 9:28:43 PM)
just as Science uses certain premises to formulate other theories
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:28:51 PM)
paul, what kind of persecution have you experienced for believing Biblical Creation as the origin of the world?
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:29:12 PM)
The WELS assumes that Scripture is clear and trustworthy.
chatmaster (Dec 11, 2007 9:29:25 PM)
How do you discuss Creation with your non-believing friends?
T-Bone (reconnect) (Dec 11, 2007 9:29:27 PM)
Paul: right
omega (Dec 11, 2007 9:29:47 PM)
Hmmm, chatmaster, great question.
House (Dec 11, 2007 9:29:56 PM)
I would use a word stronger than assumes, wouldn't you?
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:30:03 PM)
paul, I echo chatmaster's question, or how do you discus it with your non-believing collegues?
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:30:21 PM)
house, agreed...
Rob (Dec 11, 2007 9:30:22 PM)
I think you have to start like Paul did with natural knowledge of God's existence
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:30:46 PM)
I had to summarize a class in advanced evolution to prove that I understood it. The rest of the class was shocked by the special assignment during exam week. Most people tolerated me and thought that I was interesting.
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:31:34 PM)
I always point out the prime directive in science; look for natural causes.
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:31:41 PM)
paul, so you summarized your understanding of evolution, but wove your own beliefs/convictions in with it?
joel (Dec 11, 2007 9:32:24 PM)
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Agape (Dec 11, 2007 9:32:26 PM)
interesting
omega (Dec 11, 2007 9:32:45 PM)
What was your grade?
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:32:52 PM)
He already knew that I believed in Creation because I always say scientists think that some mammals went back into the sea.
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:33:45 PM)
Hey omega that's personal. :) I thought that he was going to fail me. He gave me a B.
omega (Dec 11, 2007 9:33:54 PM)
LOL
Agape (Dec 11, 2007 9:34:18 PM)
Not bad for a creationist!
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:34:41 PM)
A C in grad school is a hook. You have to have a B average.
T-Bone (reconnect) (Dec 11, 2007 9:35:08 PM)
hey Paul, this is my first time on a WELS.net chat........can you tell me the overall purpose/goal of tonight's session?
omega (Dec 11, 2007 9:35:26 PM)
You did show your faith then, without disrupting the class as you said earilier.
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:35:49 PM)
Iowa is a conservative state. The university doesn't want a big uproar and loss of support.
Liz (Dec 11, 2007 9:36:22 PM)
Ah, that helps.
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:37:11 PM)
Everyone knew by how I talked and behaved. I taught a section of undergrads. They asked me right out one day. When I said yes. They clapped.
chatmaster (Dec 11, 2007 9:37:57 PM)
Our chat host this evening is Dr. Paul Boehlke, professor of Biology at Wisconsin Lutheran College in Milwaukee, WI. Tonights topic- Faith and Evolution in high schools.
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:38:05 PM)
The thing when talking to individuals is to get people into Scripture and go to the center of our faith. What do you think of Jesus?
Agape (Dec 11, 2007 9:38:20 PM)
Did you ever have a confrontation with a person who's only belief was in evolution
Agape (Dec 11, 2007 9:38:21 PM)
?
mange (Dec 11, 2007 9:38:42 PM)
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T-Bone (reconnect) (Dec 11, 2007 9:38:50 PM)
Chatmaster: hmmmm, I read the session as being "understanding evolution and its relationship to Creation"
House (Dec 11, 2007 9:38:51 PM)
i think those that have a hard time swallowing evolution are a silent majority in many places. They learn to play the "keep silent" game in order to make it through the system with a good grade.
chatmaster (Dec 11, 2007 9:39:04 PM)
WELS Q&A has an entire section devoted to the topic of Creation. Check it out at: http://www.wels.net/cgi-bin/site.pl?1519&cuQA_qaID=1&cuTopic_topicID=72
Liz (Dec 11, 2007 9:39:10 PM)
So, did I t-bone
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:39:28 PM)
t-bone, what you read is right
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:39:30 PM)
I'm not sure. Stephen Jay Gould said he was a firm evolutionist, but you never really know.
maestro (Dec 11, 2007 9:39:32 PM)
that's what I saw too
ceb (Dec 11, 2007 9:39:43 PM)
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mange (Dec 11, 2007 9:39:44 PM)
what about the national geographic tv show sunday?
T-Bone (reconnect) (Dec 11, 2007 9:40:57 PM)
Dr. Boehlke, I had hoped we could hear a professor of Biology's view on "evolution and its relationship to creation"......rather than a random chat session
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:41:00 PM)
There will be people who believe in an evolutionary beginning but will be in Heaven if they believe in Jesus.
Agape (Dec 11, 2007 9:41:52 PM)
isn't that changing scripture then though? I mean, if you don't believe in creation, you don't believe in the same God
Liz (Dec 11, 2007 9:41:58 PM)
Yes, because creation is not a "fundamental" teaching that is needed for salvation as my pastor would put it.
Agape (Dec 11, 2007 9:42:50 PM)
What do you mean tbone?
mange (Dec 11, 2007 9:42:53 PM)
T-bone... your hope...?
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:42:55 PM)
T-bone. We can accept micro-evolution...but not a natural origin. The creation story is a miracle...we shouldn't try to do science on it.
House (Dec 11, 2007 9:43:04 PM)
t-bone, I had hoped a chat on a teen web site would have been something teens could understand.
T-Bone (reconnect) (Dec 11, 2007 9:43:12 PM)
Paul, my response question to you is then: If you believe others will be in Heaven, then why all the fuss?
newbie (Dec 11, 2007 9:45:11 PM)
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omega (Dec 11, 2007 9:45:18 PM)
I guess I would go back to what Agape was saying. If you do not believe that God created the earth and everything on it, that would include the Son of God.
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:45:28 PM)
That's a good question, T-Bone. My primary fuss is with people that try to prove God created us using science. I think they hurt us.
T-Bone (reconnect) (Dec 11, 2007 9:46:00 PM)
explain further, please, Paul.
mange (Dec 11, 2007 9:46:14 PM)
Prof. B... what geologic proofs support creation over evolution? any?
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:46:25 PM)
Omega has a good point. Jesus talked about our first parents. Creation is taught throughout the whole Bible.
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:47:08 PM)
Geology done by Christians or non-christians will be loaded with assumptions.
chatmaster (Dec 11, 2007 9:47:15 PM)
Check out this short Bible study about Creation on LivingBold: http://www.livingbold.net/welsspace/biblestudy/creation
mange (Dec 11, 2007 9:47:25 PM)
do the newly publicized fossils in north dakota support the flood at all?
mange (Dec 11, 2007 9:48:18 PM)
it just seemed that so much of what they said on National Geographic last night fit in so well with the idea of gloabal flood, etc.
rod (Dec 11, 2007 9:48:38 PM)
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Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:48:45 PM)
People should not accept Christianity or reject it on the basis of Creation/evolution debates. Scientist are generally poor theologians and also the other way around
Liz (Dec 11, 2007 9:49:12 PM)
I was always under the belief that science could not be used to prove religion...since most (if not all) of religion is based on faith.
mange (Dec 11, 2007 9:50:09 PM)
Is it naive for LES middle school science teachers to stress faith more and not worry so much about "evidence," yet being aware of new research?
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:50:20 PM)
Ryan and Pitman have a book on Noah's Flood. They think it was real. But they limit it in scope. There is evidence of former life at the bottom of the Black Sea,
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:50:47 PM)
Our reason has to be a servant of our faith.
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:52:46 PM)
Liz, Our faith is not unreasonable. But we would never accept it by ourselves. It is the gift of the Holy Spirit. He works through the Word, not science. When we believe things fall into place. Still there is much we do not know. The Bible is not a book of science.
Agape (Dec 11, 2007 9:52:51 PM)
Prof Boehlke, do you teach evolution theory as part of the science curriculum at WLC?
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:53:46 PM)
Yes. Christians need to know the theory...not believe it. That is all that public schools should ask also.
mange (Dec 11, 2007 9:54:16 PM)
I'm really thankful you are at WLC!
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:54:54 PM)
Me too. It's a blessing to teach here and to think about these things.
Agape (Dec 11, 2007 9:55:04 PM)
It makes sense to be knowledgable.
chatmaster (Dec 11, 2007 9:55:39 PM)
Be sure to go to www.livingbold.net for daily e-mail devotions, discussion boards, videos, games, articles and much more!
omega (Dec 11, 2007 9:55:44 PM)
It would be in comparison to knowing about other world religions in order to help us speak to others.
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:55:49 PM)
Lutherans have historically supported education and science. Many of the early scientists were Lutheran.
mange (Dec 11, 2007 9:56:12 PM)
i wish i knew more about the history of science
Agape (Dec 11, 2007 9:56:42 PM)
Seems as if Hollywood has taken interest in religion vs science.
mange (Dec 11, 2007 9:56:42 PM)
an excellent chat, chatmaster... wish i had gotten on earlier
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:56:51 PM)
The history of science shows that science is not objective and that it changes with time.
Agape (Dec 11, 2007 9:56:57 PM)
agree mange
mange (Dec 11, 2007 9:57:04 PM)
ty
Agape (Dec 11, 2007 9:57:25 PM)
What do you mean Prof?
mange (Dec 11, 2007 9:57:38 PM)
wish it would work out to have PB to email on a daily basis
mange (Dec 11, 2007 9:58:05 PM)
thanks.... keep up the good work...
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:58:36 PM)
Science texts do not mention theories that have been discarded. Phlogiston theory is not taught. Caloric theory is gone.
omega (Dec 11, 2007 9:58:44 PM)
Great discussion. It would be helpful to dive into a narrower subject.
Agape (Dec 11, 2007 9:59:10 PM)
I understand now. Thank you for your work.
omega (Dec 11, 2007 9:59:44 PM)
Yes, thank you Professor.
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 9:59:47 PM)
If any of you have more questions you can contact me through the college website.
chatmaster (Dec 11, 2007 9:59:48 PM)
Thank you all for coming out tonight. Please visit livingbold.net for more upcoming teen chats
Liz (Dec 11, 2007 10:00:14 PM)
Interesting chat. Thanks, everyone.
chatmaster (Dec 11, 2007 10:01:00 PM)
Please use the logout button on in the right corner
Paul Boehlke (Dec 11, 2007 10:01:52 PM)
my email address is in the Synod Yearbook and in the WELS directory on the web